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eneloop rechargable batteries

  • part 2 of my response

    ano mas magandang battery type na gagamitin sa LED flashlight? thank you


    depende sa situation kasi each has its pros and cons

    for example, i wanted a lantern that could stay idle for 1-2 years and it will be used sparingly, at lowest cost. So I chose a cdrking LED lantern with C-Zn D batteries. Since its unused for a long time and will be used sparingly, lifespan is important and high capacity is not needed. So that rules out almost all rechargeables since even eneloops have a self discharge rate, and li ions have a higher self discharge rate. Plus rechargeables cost more than primary batteries. Primary lithium (not li ion, these are not rechargeable) would have better lifespan but cost more so I live with C-Zn and just replace the batteries every couple of years or so depending sa expiration date.

    for EDC use, decent quality AA flashlights are usually cheaper since 18650 li-ion flashlights of the same quality use up more materials (bigger body) and have bigger LED emitters. If I need the extra lumens I go for li-ion, otherwise I use AA.

    In a situation where you cannot recharge then it may be cheaper to carry multiple alkaline AA's or buy from the local store than to carry multiple rechargeables or carry a large power source to recharge.

    li-ion is flammable. Aside from the higher lumens for the size, I like li ion since you can tell how much power it has left. Some li ion flashlights have indicators just like powerbanks. Thats a big annoyance for SLA batteries, you dont know if they are low batt or full.

    Speaking of SLA, price is low but its heavy and bulky.
  • Thank you for the helpful tip sir amalgam, I will be using an led flashlight for edc and it needs 4 AAA batteries,. Try ko muna mag alkaline,. Thank you
  • 4 AAA? Imo, that's not a good setup. Best for me are AA lights. You can use eneloops and primaries.

    -- edited by roceanoz on Jan 13 2016, 12:10 PM
  • 4 AAA? Imo, that's not a good setup. Best for me are AA lights. You can use eneloops and primaries.


    Unfortunately, that's what my flashlight's battery size requirement. How does it become a bad setup? Can you enlighten me please? Thank you bro.

    -- edited by ysuran on Jan 13 2016, 01:41 PM
  • How does it become a bad setup?


    caveat, i'm no expert, go to the LED flashlight thread for confirmation



    usually primary AAA's and sometimes rechargeables cost nearly the same as AA's. Or even if slightly cheaper on a per mah basis talo sila. Of course with rechargeables its less of a problem than with primaries



    The only reason I was forced to have AAA's at home is my keychain light which has to be AAA due to the size I wanted and various remote controls for tv's, etc in the house. Otherwise I standardize to AA


    And having more than 2 batteries in a flashlight has some potential issues. It may simply be that they wanted more run time, but why not go with larger cells? Most likely its a cheaper model that uses multiple cells to achieve a higher voltage. Better quality flashlights have whats essentially a transformer that even with a single 1.2v nimh ups the voltage to what the LED requires. And they may be adaptive so that once the battery is getting drained and the voltage drops the transformer compensates. This increases battery drain but in return the brightness is constant until near the end. If there is no transformer then of course you get more dip in brightness as the batteries drain

    Also with some battery chemistries, multiple cells has a danger. If one has less charge than another then as it drains it may eat electricity from the stronger battery, causing various problems.

    Plus it just more difficult to change batteries

    -- edited by AmalgamvsAloof on Jan 13 2016, 08:06 PM
  • Unfortunately, that's what my flashlight's battery size


    on the other hand well if its what you already have and it works and you are happy with it then just use it, dont spend to buy a new 1 AA or 1 18650 flashlight. sayang pera

    just think about the advice if you need to buy a new one

    however, you mentioned its a cree brand? Thats a red flag, along with the police brand. The manufacturer has no name, has a poor reputation. So it just used the brand name of one of the suppliers of one of the parts instead of its own.

    just like a SUV years ago that was made in china but proudly displayed its mercedes engine

    Usually that means the brand name part - the LED emitter - works well and will last a long time, but the rest of the flashlight may break down sooner. From painful experience usually its either the switch or for metal bodied cylindrical flashlights, the electrical contact across the screw threads from the main body to either the end cap or the head

    -- edited by AmalgamvsAloof on Jan 13 2016, 11:08 PM
  • Wow! That was something I really need to put into consideration, I can't thank you enough for that substantial information. Anyway, sorry for going out of the topic (eneloop battery). But I really do appreciate your help! Oh well, it's my first time getting an EDC flashlight (and eventually obtaining other EDC stuff too), and now that i know the reason why nitecore,fenix, and other similar types of lights have only single battery requirement.

    Thanks brother!

    -- edited by ysuran on Jan 14 2016, 01:54 PM
  • Based on your experience guys ano mas ok yung plain eneloop or yung pro? Naiisip ko kasi di naman ma utilize yung napakadaming charge cycles. By the time maubos mo yun may bagong technology na. What do you think?
  • ^depends kung saan mo gagamitin. pero sabi mo nga, ok lang sayo plain eneloop.
  • hi po. Original po kaya yung mga tindang eneloops dito sa TPC? Ang mura kasi kumpara sa True Value. heheheh! gagamitin ko sana sa mga ilaw ko sa bike. :D
  • ricperez, orig yan.
  • I have a finicky AA digital camera, and an AAA wireless telephone. Even for eneloops, after a few months of usage both of them have noticably decreased battery life.

    But, using the supposedly low batt cells in a branded LED flashlight (one AA or one AAA, with a buck–boost transformer to keep the voltage stable right up to the end), the run time seems almost normal. Using alkalines in the above 2 devices would probably work fine but with lower life, given that alkalines have lower mah. Never tried it though

    My conclusion is these devices are using the voltage as an indicator of low batt-edness. Look at the voltage curve of a nimh




    I speculate that these devices dont like voltages of around say 1.22 volts. A brand new eneloop is fine but as it ages the curve drops down a little so it looks like the magenta curve. This means the voltage drops to sub 1.22v levels quite early, with lots of power still available for devices like LED flashlights that can tolerate lower voltage.

    I found a potential solution but its kinda expensive. Li ion (li-po based on some teardowns I've seen) cells AA or AAA in size with a buck boost transformer at the end which drops the native li-po voltage to a very flat 1.5v




    approx 929 pesos, free shipping on ebay for 2 AA's and one charger

    to be continued

    -- edited by AmalgamvsAloof on Feb 20 2016, 01:44 PM

    -- edited by AmalgamvsAloof on Feb 20 2016, 01:46 PM
  • same brand this time AAA




    1100mWh this time, for 546 pesos on ebay for one piece. Expensive

    you can see that the top contains two terminals, for a total of 3. Just like a cellphone battery which has 3 terminals. So you need the special charger

    here's the graph. very flat



    <click here for link>

    -- edited by AmalgamvsAloof on Feb 20 2016, 01:45 PM
  • one potential disadvantage

    Another issue with having such a flat discharge curve is that any device that performs fuel gauging using voltage alone will report 100% capacity, until it suddenly shuts down. This could be a big problem for digital camera users, as they will have no indication that their batteries are running low, until the device abruptly stops working. If the camera was writing an image to its memory card when the battery died, it could cause the image to be corrupted, or worse, damage the file system on the card!

    <click here for link>

    for some users like users that only take a limited number of shots, it might be a worthwhile alternative. Like in early assault rifles, some people would prefer a very reliable unjammable 20 round magazine (and carry a couple of extra mags) over a 60 round magazine that may jam at round 10 or so.

    unfortunately the inefficiency of the internal buck-boost drags down actual capacity

    The PH5’s capacity is inferior to its Ni-MH counterparts (even the relatively crappy ones), and at higher discharge rates it has similar capacity to that of an alkaline at the same load, albeit with much better voltage stability than the Ni-MH or alkaline chemistries.




    Conclusion

    Overall, I’m on the fence when it comes to this battery. Its innovative design does provide unparalleled voltage stability, but its low capacity even at moderate discharge rates dampens the fun significantly. Additionally, the 2.1 amp discharge limit could prove to be a bottleneck for some high-drain applications; this, coupled with the cell’s tendency to shut down abruptly when the internal cell runs empty could potentially cause file system corruption for digital cameras that have not been designed to handle such sudden power interruptions.

    Also, the batteries are very costly. At about $10 per cell, you may want to think twice about replacing all your current disposable and rechargeable batteries with these newfangled Li-ion ones. Don’t forget the charger either, as a special charger is required to make contact with a recessed terminal on the top of the battery.

    Overall, this cell is… interesting. Just don’t expect a miracle in a steel can.

    Pros:

    Excellent voltage stability, even at high loads
    Li-ion chemistry allows for a very lightweight cell, even with the addition of a DC-DC converter
    High output voltage could allow some devices to run more efficiently

    Cons:

    Low capacity – provides a mere 1200 mAh @ 2 amps, and up to 1700 mAh @ 250 mA (even alkaline batteries can do better than this)
    Abrupt shutdown when the battery is overloaded, overheated, or over-discharged
    Runs hot at high loads (and therefore is fairly inefficient)
    Expensive! Costs approximately $10/cell
    Requires proprietary charger

    Bottom Line: This is a niche product and should not be considered a universal replacement for alkaline or Ni-MH AA batteries.

    <click here for link>

    Reading the conclusion, maybe its time to replace my camera instead of trying this. It is 2008 vintage. Maybe one with a li-ion batt?

    -- edited by AmalgamvsAloof on Feb 20 2016, 01:56 PM
  • Another 2 theoretical options. The camera is 2 x AA, and I already have a couple of li ion 14500's and charger

    If I put in one 14500 and one dummy battery, it might work. But then again it might blow up. 2.4v is rather far away from 3.6v

    Maybe I can find a 3.6v to 1.5v buck boost transformer and fit it inside a dummy battery?
  • Hi everyone. Those who are using a Sanyo NC-MQN04ES charger, how would you know if the batteries are fully charged already? TIA!
  • Hi everyone. Those who are using a Sanyo NC-MQN04ES charger, how would you know if the batteries are fully charged already? TIA!


    wala ba sa manual? wala bang indicator like a light? If wala then its not a very good charger. A good charger must either stop charging or go to trickle mode AND tell the user that its finished/in trickle charge mode